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36 Comments

Bollywood’s Most Uncomfortable Question


Note – i usually stay away from any kind of communal discourse and even when commenting on one, i make it a point to use terms like ‘a certain socio – cultural group’ rather than name communities. but since this post is an unbiased effort to put things in perspective, i am using the names of various (not just two) communities. also the fact that i will have to use them so many times and for so many communities,  that it will be very cumbersome to keep referring to them with other phrases.

still if the mods feel this post is beyond the scope of naachgaana, they can remove it rather than banning me. and i hope no abusive comments of communal nature are posted.

 

 

well this is the most uncomfortable question (at least for liberals and seculars) that has ever risen concerning bollywood. there has been a certain section of audiences in genral and NG mebers in particular who seem to think that the three khans (or may be all khans) are deliberately propped by muslim fans. on the surface the exceptionally high percentage of muslim actors in india (3 out of 10 = 30%, 6 out of 15 = 40% ) in recent times makes this a valid, rational  and legitimate question and there is nothing wrong with raising it.

 

as an aside, in a larger socio-political context i would like to state that i believe politics and society at large have to take the method of  working for various ‘interest groups’ and i have nothing against the dalit politics of mayawati, hindu politics of bjp or even maratha manus politics of sena/MNS, as long as the leaders keep the interests of their groups on the table in a discussion  and no violence is used to protect them at ground level. in fact that’s exactly how the interests of smaller (weaker) groups like minorities, women, gays etc. can be protected.

 

coming back to bollywood and the supposed (current)  ’over representation’ of khans/muslims, let me make my case that its purely by the theory of probability and the larger sample (of time or names) you take you will realize that the representation of muslims in bollywood is not disproportionately high at all.

 

first lets understand a basic scientific truth. take an evenly designed/built coin. when you toss it once and ‘tails’ comes up the conclusion can be drawn that its 100% tails every time you toss a coin. but toss it again and if a head comes, your theory goes for a ‘toss’. but even if the second time again ‘tail’ comes it still doesn’t prove that the probability of ‘tail’ is 100% the 3rd time a head comes and the probability of heads and tails looks 33:66 percent. but even that is wrong. the more times you toss the coin, the more you see the gap between the two decreasing. finally at a very high ‘even number’ it will have to be 50-50 and a very high odd number there will be a very small gap which will go away as you toss the coin once more. this off course assuming there is no bias in the design of the coin (like sholay’s coin)

 

simlarly though 40% of today’s top stars may appear to be muslims that make up less than 20% of indian population, if you take top 20 stars of bollywood in over all 100 years, the percentage will go down. see it for yourself.

1. k l sehgal 2. ashok kumar 3. dilip kumar 4. raj akpoor 5. devanand 6. rajendra kumar 7. manoj kumar 8. dharmendra 9. sunil dutt 10. jeetendra 11. rajesh khanna 12. amitabh bachchan 13. vinod khanna 14 shashi kapor 15. shatrughan sinha 17. rishi kapoor. 18 . sunny deol 19 sanjay dutt 20 jackie shroff

 

if u realize the representation of muslims in the top 20 till the 80s is just 5% . is it because of any communal bias of audiences? NO!

 

Now here are two ways to prove it. 1st is to increase the  list further.

21. anil akpoor 22. mithun chakraborty 23. aamir khan 24 salman khan 25 ajay devgan 26. govinda 27 aksahy kumar 28 sunil shetty 29 shahrukh khan  30 saif ali khan

 

as you see just by taking list to top 30 (50% longer than top 20) what seemed like a 75% bias against the ‘muslim actors has been already corrected.

 

the other way is to look at the top heroines.

 

if u were in the 40s and 50s you cpould be forgiven for thinking that all bollywood heroines were muslims (this off course would not annoy as much because all social prejudices operate with an inbulit  gender bias in which ‘their women coming is always ok but not ‘their men’ coming in. but that’s not within the scope of this article.)

1. durga khote 2. suraiya 3. noorjehaan 4. kamini kaushal 5. nargis 6 madhubala 7.  meena kumari 8. nutan 9. waheeda rehman 10 vyjyantimala

 

on the surface it seems that 20% muslim women represent 50% of the industry. but increase the list and you see the ratio becoming fair, so to speak.

11. mala sinha 12. asha parekh 13 saira banu 14. sharmila tagore 15. saadhna 16. babita 17 hema malini  18. rekha 19. zeeant amaan 20 jaya bhaduri

 

even now it appears that muslim women are over represented at 7 out of 20 = 35%

 

but trust the theory of probability to correct the bias ’randomly’

 

21 reena roy 22. dimple kapadia 23 parveen babi 24 amrita singh 25 sridevi 26 jaya prada 27 meenakshi sheshadri 28 madhuri dikshit 29 raveena tondon 30 manisha koirala

 

as 3 more muslim heroines (reena roy, dimple kapadia, parveen babi) appear in the list it looks like that at 10 out of 30, they still over represented. but take the list to 40 and see.

31 karisma kapoor 32 kajol 33 tabu 34 sonali bnedre 35 rani mukherji 36 shilpa shetty 37 a iashwarya rai 38 kareena kapoor 39 priyanka chopra 40 katrina kaif

 

and you see at 12 0ut of 40 the ratio has come down to less tha  30 % add deepika padukone, anushka sharma, asin , pareeniti and older ones like kanan devi, ruby mayers etc to the list and you realise the representation of muslim heroines will come to exactly in the ratio of population

 

not only that. make the list a little longer (of both male and female actors) and it will  also adequately represent the populations with 2-3% like sikhs and Christians and an even minicule ones like jews,  also fairly accurately. the names of john abarham, dharmendra, nadira, sunny deol etc prove this point.

 

so there is no deliberate attempt by any one community to ‘dominate’ bollywood. its just ‘randomely’ that at various points in time, one community or the other seems to be over represented, which is corrected over a period of time.

 

and if at all a concious/subconcious bias in bollywood its on the basis of cast/class. try explaining the exteremly low representation of 60% dalits and OBCs in the industry. (you can read a detailed post on this here - http://www.naachgaana.com/2012/06/30/castiesm-in-bollywood-on-and-off-screen/ )

Comments

  1. iitianWay

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    no one can dominate by just an attempt..they have to prove again and again…same is proved by head and tail whenevr a coin is tossed. both (head/tail) run for thier show…to proe their existence.

    danish aaj probabilty theory padai thi kya chemistry madam ne…bahut anadar tak asar kar gayi lagta hain!! :)

  2. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @iitianway – yes iitianway. but still some ppl think that the ‘support’ of muslim auideinces to khans is for reasons other than quality of acting and films.

    and by the way probability theory maths mein hai, chemistry mein nahin.

  3. iitianWay

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    that is applicable to salman only(not to other khans..that muslims support him left and right) and that happened after his first Eid release and later got consolidated iwth subsequent Eid releases.
    This evident when u talk to them in general…they love him ..praise him near to god…dont know about others but i have seen this…chhahe aaj woh kuch bhi de…even joker-2.

    // and rahi baat prob ki to woh chhahe kisi bhi subject mein aaye par padane waale pe depend karta hain woh kitna close se and kitni gahraai se padata hain ;) //

  4. ank_16n

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    tumne toh Probability ki aisi ki taise kar di…..

    agar Delhi mein hi ho …toh kabhi ‘FS’ ko apne saath leke mere pass aana jo tumne…
    20 lines mein Coin ki Toss probability di hai main tumhe uska 2 line ka Formula with explanation de dunga……Space waste hone se bach jaayegi..!!

  5. ank_16n

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    @iitianWay—-agar aap phichle 4 saal ki baat kar rahe hai Salman ki toh aap sahi hai(all bcoz of EID Factor)…..

    but with my experience before that clearly says the opposite to what u are seeing today..!!

  6. iitianWay

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    yes @ank…it happened only after his first and subsequent EID releases..

  7. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @iitianway – if the success of a diwali release of a khan (whose content has nothing to do with their faith) indicates religion based support would u apply the same formula to actors from other religions whose films release on acertain festival?

    and the ‘god like reverence’ from salman may come from the projection in media of his philanthropic activities but why wud it come with just an eid release.

    a sharukh is more likely to get religion based support for a film like my name is khan, noit salman for wanted dabangg, bodyguard and ett ( where he an indian hindu falls in love with a a pakistani muslim woman – the pet peeve of the narrow minded bigots) .

    and though wat u say abt salman cud be a compliment (chaahe wo joker 2 bhi de de) its not true. how come mamk and london dreams fare so badly and did not get this support (i am not including veer in this as i feel it did get the salmania support)

    by the way ready and dabangg 2 did not even release on eid.

  8. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @ank – why dont u put up ur two line theory in the comments section?

    and if u feel wat iitianway is saying is true for last 4 years then why not for before? where was his muslim support between 2000-2009 as u keep harping? wat was the important factor that made muslims suddenly sway towards him?

    well i will tell u wat. his support was not the muslim support but the support of the 65% strong pan indian middle class downwards audiences that had become so irrelevant between 2000-2009 becoz of low ticket prices (compared to fast and upcoming multiplexes) that despite highest footfall they could not give huge gross to salman’s films.

    wat changed 2009 onwards is that once the urban metro market had peaked, big exhibitors as well as those from non – corporate sector focussed on renovating ss in smaller towns etc and raising ticket prices. so the same phenomenon that made salman look like less popular despite highest footyfall the same phenomenon was reversed and the truth cam out.

    warna 2009 mein koi jaadu to hua nahin tha.

    • dr.nick

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      exactly my thoughts danish.a tere naam had more footfalls than a khnh but it didnt reflect in the collections.now market expansion has happened in tier2 nd 3 cities which is helping salman films.

  9. iitianWay

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    But that is the the fact…danish u agree or not! ..or u want to remain or show ignorant it is ur cause….and it is big lol if u think it is b/c of his being human chairty people praise him or treat him near god.

  10. rockie_Dabangg2

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    Salman having only muslims as fanbase is just an excuse made by some on NG.

    He has universal pan India fanbase and this has been proved by blockbusters like Ready – Dabangg2 which were non EID releases.

    —-
    About the topic. I agree with this probablity theory.
    If you see the next line of star’s after the 3 Khan’s there are only 2 Imran Khan and Emran Hashmi who are muslims.

    Rest all – From HR, Jr B, John Abraham, Arjun Kapoor, Sid Malhotra, Varun Dhawan, Ayuushman, Ranvir, Ranbir Kapoor most are non muslims.

    —-
    Danish Bhai once again a good theory covering a large span of around 60+ years of stars in BW.

  11. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    Salman having only muslims as fanbase is just an excuse made by some on NG.

    It is just like saying, “Muslims boycotted Gadar”

    The best collections for Gadar came from places like Bareilly, Moradabad and aligarh, that has >= 50 % muslims.

  12. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    Danish, really did not like the context of this post. Religion has nothing to do with stardom. Sometimes I feel awkward discussing religion in trivial things.imo, religion is a private affair…as private as your marriage. Religion is your medium to connect to almighty. Marriage is your medium to serve almighty ( if u r a husband of course).
    If one doesn’t talk about marriage in open, why do so about religion?

  13. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    I hav not come across anyone praising any actor due to his religion. Its more due to the “connect” thn their star power, religion or boxiffice records. May be the ones who deliberately choose based on religion are the ones who blame/claim such things…

  14. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @iitianway – apne views ke basis par hi facts/quality/reality ka faisla kar loge kya?

    just like i have tried explaining what changed after 2009 in support of my opinion. u also try explain what changed after 2009 according to ur theory. did suddenly the musim population grow after 2009? did salman became ‘more muslim’ after 2009?

    either give ur theory or faidn fault in mine. aise hi thodi facts bata doge that suddenly ppl started treating salman like god. has no muslim actor ever released a film on eid earlier? i think qurbani was released on eid though i m not sure. why did he not get the same adulation?

    @rockie – thanx foradding another perfect point to my theory. the next line of stars in fact has not a single muslim actor (as i have already included emraan and imraan in the top 15 list that has 40% (6 actors) representation. these 6 include salman, srk, aamir, saif, emraan, imraan.

    which shows not a single actor in the next line of actors – ranvee singh, varun, siddharth ( i ha dalso included hrithik and ranbeer in top 15) – and a plethora of star sons about to be launched ( of which at least a couple will be big stars) is muslim.

    it just shows it was by sheer co incidence that the three khans became huge superstars simultaneously and there is no exclusive/intentional muslim audiences support.

    @tango – though theoretically muslims bycotting gadar is still possible (unles there is clear empirical evidence that muslims supported gadar. but gadar had content that could offend pakistanis, seculars and muslims. but thats another matter altogether. my theory never was that various religious groups dont boycott films based on contents. they might. but ppl dont support actors on the basis of their religion.

  15. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @gorilla – though i have already mentioned in my title that this is the most uncomfortable question related to bollywood, i dont think it needs to be brushed under the carpet – if it is dealt with in a neutral, scientific manner.

    secondly this post is not discussing religion after all – its still discussing bollywood.

    and by the way i did not get ur last comment – how is marriage ( of males ) a way to serve almighty? unless u think wives are almighty!

    @FS – strong point u make and i partially agree.

  16. rockie_Dabangg2

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    @Gorilla : “Marriage is your medium to serve almighty ( if u r a husband of course).”

    Please can you elaborate?

  17. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @Danish/Rockie- That marriage is a medium to serve almighty is a realistic scenario where after marriage a guy loses his masters degree and a gal gains her masters :)

  18. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @Danish/Rockie- That marriage is a medium to serve almighty is a realistic scenario where after marriage a guy loses his bachelor’s degree and a gal gains her masters’ :)

  19. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @gorilla – so my guess was right.

  20. sanjeev - radhey - 6th bb in a row

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    How to know who are Hindus and who are Muslims?

  21. iitianWay

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    @tango sir and @danish..i am not saying only muslims watches his movie…i am just saying only one thing

    “after his EID releases ..starting 2010 he started gaining very large support among them(masses) and they started treating him as their real hero!!”

    salman like other khans also has support base in non muslims community and geography too!!..but the blockbuster status to all his movies is b/c of this factor only ..and i am repeating ..i am saying for 2010 EID release onwards ..prior to that his success or failure was completely his own strength/weakness.

    • sanjeev - radhey - 6th bb in a row

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      @iitianway: And what about ready and dabangg 2?

  22. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @sanjeev – iitianway is using deductive logic in this way – ” if salman films are huge hits on eid, muslims are watching them ” by this theory he doesnt need to exactly find out who are the muslims and who are the hindus. so that question is not valid here.

    but three other questions are relevant

    1. how were ready and dabangg2 such big hits?

    2. whey did not the earlier eid releases by othermuslim actors, including salman have the ame effect.

    3. most important – what happnd in 2009 to make muslims lobby behind salman suddenly.

    by the way this post is about all khans/ muslim actors.

    • ank_16n

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      danish i have give reply to ur this question as similar reply to Rockie…
      over to u now..!!

  23. iitianWay

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    danish and radhe ..it is very clear when they find in him their hero they will watch all his movies…whether they are on eid or not ..b/c he consolidated his image among them by releaseing 3 consecutive EID releases….
    and mind u danish this is based on conversation with people among his mass fan base..

    and what u r saying about all khans/muslims actor.. it is not new ..it is all probabiltiy theory which runs this world…

  24. iitianWay

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    and if he does not have any EID release this year and next year …certainly it will affect him badly…did u see how yash used this phrase This EID..This EID when the movie ETT was actually released on I-Day..
    EID is the FACTOR my dear danish

  25. ank_16n

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    @rockie_Dabangg2—-
    “Salman having only muslims as fanbase is just an excuse made by some on NG.

    He has universal pan India fanbase and this has been proved by blockbusters like Ready – Dabangg2 which were non EID releases. ”

    that included me or Danish or anyother member….(please Elaborate)
    as far as i m concerned i didn’t even mentioned anywhere that–
    “Salman having only muslims as fanbase is just an excuse made by some on NG.”

    u really need to understand what i was saying…..
    By releasing the movie at EID does not increase his Fanbase but he does get support or in other words inclination towards that particular Actor and when he releases movie on that festive 3 or 4 times that inclination becomes permanent..!!
    same can be said for SRK or AJAY when they release their movies at Diwali for 4-5 times..!!

  26. ank_16n

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    On a lighter note—-

    Sanjeev and Rockie since u both include Salman’s next movie name in ur screen name will next time ur name appears in any comment or post as—
    Sanjeev-Mental and Rockie-Mental ??????????

    just a simple Query as the thing just strike me..!! :) :) :)

    • sanjeev - radhey - 6th bb in a row

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      @ank: let the name be confirmed and I will change it. We are real fans. Even if his next movie name is called gay, I will put sanjeev-gay.

      • ank_16n

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        that’s the spirit…….it was just a light query don’t take it seriously..!! :)

  27. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @ank – u have not given a reply to any of my questions or rockie’s except for claiming u cud have explained the probability theory in 2 lines. which i asked u to post in the commensta nd u did not even do that.

    and if u insist (as u do in ur unrelated comment to rockie, that salman’s eid benefit is as much as ajay and srk’d diwali advantage (how come akshay doesnt have the diwali advantage despite releasing 6-7 films on diwali?) even then u have not been able to explain ready and dabangg 2.

    @dr nick – yes thats the real reason. legions of salman fanshave been there since 1989 but the ticket prices of tickets in their areas have gone up now and we can all see the result.

  28. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @iitianway – that still doesnt explain why ajsay/sharukh/akshya’s diwli releases are not half as successful as salman’s eid releases.

    and ur ‘random’ converstaion with fans dont amount to emprical evidence.

    and wat yashraj did or did not do was based on their perception (that salman sells on eid) that still doesnt make it the truth. data does. try explaining the raging success of ready and dabangg 2 – or for that matter try explaining the faliure of london dreams after the eid hit wanted.

    @ank – so wat! all salman fans will happily take the nick – mental’ if he is releasing a film by that title. ismein kya hai?

    in fact even if salman’s next film is titled ‘ank’ i will add that to my nick happily.

    • ank_16n

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      did i said its a big deal it was just a Query…!!

      and yup u can add Akshay on that list if he release atleast 2 of his movies on EID….

      yup even he was benefited by Diwali….

      Remember Garam Masala vs Kyu ki
      Blue vs All the best vs MAMK

  29. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    You are right.In the 1950s till mid 1960s there was one muslim superstar and one in top 4.Then from mid 60s,there was only one muslim actor in top 7 till 1969.There were no muslim superstars or any muslim actor in top 7 in 1970s,1980s.
    Dimple kapadia is not a muslim.

  30. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 0 Thumb down 0

    @ank – if blue was a ‘benefit’ for akhsy then god save salman from any such ‘benefit’ eid diwali or Christmas.

    @SV – i think u agree with my theory then. also i hope u r talking of only male actors. females were in majority thru the 50s and in fact till the 80s.

    and dimple kapadia comes from an ‘ismaili muslim’ family of chunnibhai kapadia and bitti kapadia. she is a muslim. she never converted even after marriage to rajesh khanna.

    as an afterthought, shud we count dharmendra as muslim now since he converted to islaam for his second marriage to hema malini?

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