TDK crosses 350 M in 14 Days : NAACHGAANA

TDK crosses 350 M in 14 Days

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August 1st, 2008

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Comment by som on 1 August 2008:

Should end around $450M.
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

Could do a little more also as long as it doesn’t fall by another 52% this weekend. This is obviously a very huge gross. The worldwide total stands at 479m. Titanic had a worldwide gross of 1.8bn. Let’s see how far TDK can go. And Titanic was 11 years ago. Think about this, if TDK goes to 500m that would be quite stunning and still this would be 100m short of Titanic domestically! What this really means is that with time a film will have an initial big enough and trending decent enough to catch Titanic or surpass it. But Titanic nonetheless remains a historic milestone. This kind of trending happens once in a lifetime. It’s like Sholay!
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

Another factoid — in 1999 Phantom Menace off a 64m opening weekend went upto 430m. Stunning as TDK has been it has not matched the trending of Phantom Menace so far.
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

An older comment:

“Batman Begins incidentally fell 43%. The first Spidey fell 38%, the second close to 50%, Pirates fell 27%, the second one here 54%, the third one like Spidey 3. More recently Iron Man dropped 48%.”

These are drops over the second weekend..
Comment by som on 1 August 2008:

“The worldwide total stands at 479m.”

Don’t think it is the correct figure Satyam. I guess Boxofficemojo has not updated since 7th July for many countries.
Comment by som on 1 August 2008:

But yeah I am little surprised that TDK took a significant fall in the 2nd weekend considering the reviews have been fantastic and I am led to believe the WOM is also very good as well.Unless it shows good stability from here on, lets say 40% drop on an average, the $450M figure will also be difficult to reach.
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

Here are some factors though:

1)TDK ultimately is a dark, intense drama. For this kind of subject to do as much is remarkable. It’s not family friendly the way a Star Wars or a Spider-Man is.

2)You probably cannot get to massive totals without multiple viewings by female audiences, possibly teenage ones. My hunch is that much as the box office both in the US and India is dominated by younger viewers (under 30 and really the key group these days is in the 15-25 range for the most part) women probably outnumber men. Which is why a Titanic was seen endlessly by this segment but males, no matter how much they like TDK, are unlikely to do the same.

3)Having said that when it’s an event like Titanic such explanations collapse beyond a point. Not every film with appeal for female audiences grosses half as much! Similarly TDK did get a universal audience.

4)But these demographics are nonetheless important to figure out what genres are more naturally advantaged than others. Big films in certain genres can never gross as much as big films in certain other genres, based on current demographic trends. Sometimes there are films that suddenly alter this demographic mix. Say a Vivah. But that’s rare.
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

Som, Phantom Menace did 493m outside the US to give the film a grand total of 924m. Also remember that Dark Knight released in the UK a week later. Not sure if this was true for other important markets as well. So it should catch up.
Comment by beld on 1 August 2008:

Satyam, as expressed many times, I don’t agree with the trending comparisons. It has to go hand in hand with the opening too. I mean - u can’t compare a 200m opening trending at 40% to a 50m opening trending at 60%. The marketing and business dynamics are just plain different. Its called product life cycle management
Comment by som on 1 August 2008:

“This kind of trending happens once in a lifetime. It’s like Sholay!”

I guess Market has changed significantly over the years.We have seen movies doing great business over the opening weekend, almost maximizing the potential never manage to show great trending.

I seriously doubt we will see something like a Sholay or a HAHK or DDLJ in future as far as trending is concerned.These days the distributors by circulating as many as prints as they can to make sure that maximum number of people watch the movie in the opening weekend or in the first week before the WOM kicks in.
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

Som, I don’t want to convey the wrong impression. TDK has done extraordinarily well. really more could not have been expected from it given the kind of film it is. The film attracted a universal audience but it’s harder for this film to retain the universal audience as opposed to something like Star Wars, at least to the same degree. By the way another thing to factor in with TDK as opposed to Phantom Menace and some of the other films from the past (including Titanic!) is that this film saw the largest release ever on IMAX. There was an article on this in the Times which I probably posted here but that jacks up the totals quite a bit. The average IMAX ticket in the US is 12.80. So when you factor in this as well I suspect that TDK is really not getting a total much bigger than Phantom Menace 9 years ago.

All of this is not meant to take away anything from the film’s smashing success. Just a matter of doing comparisons and understanding what the different trending patterns mean in each instance. In ‘93 Jurassic Park opened to 60m and made 357m. Now that’s trending! It’s worldwide gross was the same as that of Phantom Menace six years before the latter!
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

Som: Not sure if I completely agree. yes event films like Sholay or Titanic are always rare. And certainly saturating the market not to mention piracy takes away the potential. But when Titanic released all these factors were still in play. Similarly in India you can still get extraordinary trending for a film that truly connects. And therein lies the rub. This is where trending is important. I just gave some random examples but even in saturated markets some blockbusters trend better than others. Most of the time what happens is that commercial industries produce disposable cinema that draws big initials based on various factors but doesn’t really connect the way it should. People show up for films even when they don’t particularly care for the subject and so on, even when the WOM is just average based on hype and so forth. As a result trending gets affected. The film makes enough money and people are happy. But the opportunity cost of producing that high gross becomes increasingly higher. The classic example is OSO. The film was hyped to death. The advertising specially in the last week or so was simply crazy. No one factors in these costs in the media when all kinds of numbers are thrown out. The film did very well, no doubt but whether it’s this film or D2 these films have hardly done the sort of trending that really serious blockbusters have done. I said at the time that D2 could have cracked 100crores had a really good film been made. But one could still watch the film a couple of times. It was enjoyable. Most people felt the same about OSO. But these aren’t films that connect. This is disposable cinema. This is why RDB is remembered today far more than many bigger grossers. Hollywood is the same and it has even shorter attentions spans. But those event films are still possible provided people try to make authentic films. Take TDK. This film has become an event even beyond the numbers because it’s the rare Hollywood blockbuster that’s also authentic. And people can sense this. Much as Titanic despite the cheesy love story was nonetheless authentic. This is by the way where the prestige factor comes in. It has some correlation with authenticity. Also it is a sign of our times that much as people constantly feed on the fake an inauthentic there is at the same time a paradoxical urge for the real or the authentic. Something that is not simply plastic.
Comment by satyam on 1 August 2008:

Anyway I’ll catch up with this discussion later..
Comment by Achilles on 1 August 2008:

Since the other thread was closed off becoz of ur abuses (not a rarity anyday!):

Anyways, i said u are CONSIDERED ‘wise n erudite’ by ur followers here … but than we all know what comments and views u come up with.

“Of course I wasn’t saying anything either. Now if the Bachchan shows are stupendously successful, if people are loving the Drona preview, if Abhishek is going to pelt them out with Drona, Dostana, D6, to yaar is main meri kya galti hai? Isi liye advise kiya tha, he’s the dark horse. Don’t blame me for making the right prediction.”

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA … This hardly even provokes reactions! LOL … daydreaming? only silly abhi fans can think that lame drona promo can work! it looks worse than even the LS 2050 first promo … and w know the same excitement was shown for SFX in that case too.

anyways, isnt it funny that since u made a prediction for TDK (like many other movies which never came true and drives u nearer to insanity) … now u are hell intent to downplay TDK in all possible ways … just 2 weeks from release and the verdict on TDK trending is given! LOL

Now u are so desperate that u start commenting on how dubious my likings are???? i like it!
Comment by Achilles on 1 August 2008:

And now personal mails will be sent among all the Ku Klax Klan members of NG to get together and come after me with their abuses.

LOL
Comment by som on 1 August 2008:

Would have movies like CDI or RDB or LRM done more than 100 cr had they opened like say an OSO or D2?Don’t you think there could be a case of a saturated market.
Comment by Achilles on 1 August 2008:

Som - dont pay heed to all this bogus theory … thy just need any reason to propagate propaganda … if TDK gets to 600 from here … we will suddenly hear the inflation reason for bringing it down.

TDK has already done enuf … if not more to prove to the world what a superhero movie can be … in quality and in the box-office … and this is not a 2 week movie in any case.
Comment by Achilles on 1 August 2008:

Another link for high resolution Watchmen trailer:

http://www.firstshowing.net/2008/07/17/must-watch-zack-snyders-watchmen-trailer-absolutely-stunning/

This trailer is more impressive than Wolverine …and the song just rocks! Dont know why they took so long to give vision to Alan Moore’s legendary series … btw, V for Vendetta could not even come close to the graphic novel … but then the watchmen comics were more cinematic in the first place and shud be easier to capture the essence.

The look and feel of this movie is spellbinding … 2009 already seems to be too interesting.
Comment by Tango on 1 August 2008:

Achiles bhai morning, do you know the official budget of Drona now ?

Chalo phir kabhi sahi
Comment by Achilles on 1 August 2008:

Hello Tango Bhai - please feel free to enlighten me!

Wont be surprised if its down to 10 crores now.
Comment by Tango on 1 August 2008:

And remember anything against Amar Singh’s dog will be considered anti-Amitabh Bachchan.

Anything against Abhishek’s paawala will be considered anti-Amitabh Bachchan.

Anything against Aishawraya’s cat will be considered anti-Amitabh Bachchan.
Comment by Tango on 1 August 2008:

Its 55-60 crores now as per trade magazines, unless and until trade magazines are no longer reliable and filmi kaliyan the officially referred to journal
Comment by Tango on 1 August 2008:

**Abhishek’s paanwala**
Comment by jayshah on 1 August 2008:

Carrying on at this rate (53% week on week fall) TDK would reach 450MM. But as per other BB’s in past week three, week four and week five have been known to trend better. So 500MM is still possible.
Comment by SHETTY on 1 August 2008:

“Anything against Aishawraya’s cat”

Tango bhaiyya getting naughty
Comment by rks on 1 August 2008:

Link1

A very good comparison. Check the different Tabs.

The Dark Knight
Titanic
Shrek 2
The Phantom Menace
Comment by Tango on 1 August 2008:

No yaar Shetty the thing is if I say I do not like Amitabh doing roles like Nishabd and RGV Ki Aag it amounts to being blasphemous.

I say Amar ‘Dalal’ Singh is like targetting Bachchan !

Wel, its my choice I lobe him in Cheeni Kum, Ek Ajnabee, Bhoothnath abd Srkar Raj but not a Nishabd & RGV Ki Aag.
Comment by Tango on 1 August 2008:

Shetty its Kuselan not Kuchelan in Karnataka ?
Comment by som on 1 August 2008:

“Anything against Aishawraya’s cat”

Tango bhaiyya getting naughty”

I have heard the cat is a very cute one.
Comment by Tango on 2 August 2008:

Som

Dekho kya dialoge aaya hai

“Khoobsoorat hasinaaon ki billiyan bhi aksar khoobsoorat hoti hai”

But not billas (tom cat)
Comment by manoj16_391 on 2 August 2008:

Achilles,ur comments on this report?:
http://www.naachgaana.com/2008/07/31/25-weeks-for-jodhaa-akbar/
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

Systematically deconstructing everyone around Bachchan whether it’s Amar Singh or Abhishek or RGV points only in one direction. I think we know what’s going on!

On the Drona budget hey let’s follow the OSO example. Throw in the wildest numbers when the film is under production but then let them shrink by a factor of four when the film actually gets released and finally have a selling price a little higher than JTYJN! LOL! But hey if the film looks like a potential hit let’s call it average at 70 crores! This is where the budget numbers come in handy!

Now I’m against TDK?! I think I’ve seen it more times than anyone here if I’m not mistaken! Why the George Bush disease (’you’re either with us or against us’) afflicts people here on every issue beats me!

On Watchmen I hope the film matches the potential of is simply an outstanding comic book (in 12 parts, now cheaply available in trade ppbk). Anyone who has interest in this sort of thing should definitely check this out.
Comment by Tango on 2 August 2008:

And remember anything against Amar Singh’s dog will be considered anti-Amitabh Bachchan.

Anything against Abhishek’s paanwala will be considered anti-Amitabh Bachchan.

Anything against Aishawraya’s cat will be considered anti-Amitabh Bachchan.
Comment by rockstar on 2 August 2008:

WELL SAID SATYAM
Comment by Tango on 2 August 2008:

And dont try indirect references to catch my attention . I am not interested in interacting with small timers. And I have said that clearly otherwise you will be crying rape rape again.
Comment by rockstar on 2 August 2008:

well i wonder who gets offended if people says anything against sonia gandhi’s paltu kutta
Comment by rockstar on 2 August 2008:

satyam its all in the mind u can say anything against amarsingh’s dog or karan johar’s boyfiend
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

“And I have said that clearly otherwise you will be crying rape rape again.”

This is in extremely bad taste… par for the course for you..

well I’ve been attacked by you on communal grounds, on sexist grounds, on grounds of sexuality and what not.. this I suppose is the latest one..
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

And I am actually not offended at being the recipient of such a line here but moreso for the atrocious sexist implications of such..

I am reminded of that line from Souten:

‘tehzeeb aate aate hi aati hai..”
Comment by rockstar on 2 August 2008:

“On the Drona budget hey let’s follow the OSO example. Throw in the wildest numbers when the film is under production but then let them shrink by a factor of four when the film actually gets released and finally have a selling price a little higher than JTYJN! LOL! But hey if the film looks like a potential hit let’s call it average at 70 crores! This is where the budget numbers come in handy!”

hmmm let the time come we will know there are many gossip magzines and there are some freelancers ( who most of time boast as they are the required authority no wonder empty vessel sounds more ) , anyway oso was supposed to come on 2000 print if u where to beleive gossips then
Comment by Tango on 2 August 2008:

tehzeeb tumme to aaye nahi 8 saal mein, na ummeed hai ki ayegi, because kahin door door se bhi nahi guzri tehzeeb tumhaare.

Ab ayegi bhi nahi, rest assured.
Comment by rockstar on 2 August 2008:

arz hai

woh naam mita nahi paye 40 saalo mein kisi ki ju hazuri kar le de ke ab bhi sar phor rahe hain yaha par

rest assured sir phodte hi rahenge apna
Comment by JasonTodd on 2 August 2008:

as the person who’s tracked this movie more than any of you
ach - stop being a dick
satyam - don’t worry

everybody - box office isnt the same as it used to. you dont have long days because of home video anymore, after 3-4 month we expect our dvd/blu-ray.

tdk lives in a time that wasnt titantic, jurassic park, phantom menace.

titanic is in a fucking league of its own and pretty much untouchable until movie prices go to $20. phantom menace was the first new star wars in yers everyone and theyr momma saw it, and then they saw it again because they were in denial at how shitty it was (it was really shitty).

dark knight will pretty much take the number 2 or 3 spot from now on, but most likely be bested within another 2-3 years, so really who cares, what we need to understand and love about this box office is:

DC comics may get more opp for movies

Allan Horn will give chris nolan money just to shoot an ugly broad giving birth because he thinks he can make money

christian bale will continue to play christian bale roles

i still watched the movie before any of you. hah
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

JasonTodd: LOL!
Comment by Achilles on 2 August 2008:

Jason - calling anyone dick does not make ur points any strnger … but then u never have a point … thats the point.

so the mails has been sent … anyways, where TDK lands up will be seen by all. we will see if the despo predictons come true or not.

& Jason ‘Dickhead Toady’ Todd - ask ur guru to apply the trending theory for his fav SR … that wud be more interesting read, rather than how wonderful Titanic is … but then cant expect anything more from girlie cry babes or gutter-shitters like u.
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

JasonTodd: I didn’t mind Phantom Menace. I really hated Attack of the Clones. Revenge of the Sith was good but not excellent in my opinion. My favorite installment remains Empire Strikes Back. I think that in a weird sense the new trilogy deconstructed the old one. Because the mythological sense of the latter was reinforced by the fact that we didn’t know what really happened. How Darth Vader ‘became’ and so forth. The ‘unknown’ adds power to stories. But also the whole ‘Christological’ parallels of Phantom Menace turned me off a bit.

By the way I agree with your points on TDK. The film might do better or worse than we expect in the final run. I am with Jay and Som in thinking that 450m is a given but with really strong legs in the latter weeks (depends on repeats) it could do 475m and possibly 500m. This is obviously astonishing. But the evidence for advancing a claim that it could touch Titanic or outgross it has never been there. It seems to me that the onus is on those who would advance such a claim.

As for the idea that I’m somehow trying to pull down TDK yeah well I have a thing for Leo and I am not as attracted to Bale!
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

Also note how people who send emails all over the place themselves accuse others of doing the same! For the record Jason and I have never exchanged an email. But if we had we wouldn’t reveal it here much as we wouldn’t reveal that we are really Batman and Robin.
Comment by Achilles on 2 August 2008:

I think everyone knows abt the ‘mails’ between ‘Ku Klux Klan’ fanatics of NG … as for outgrossing Titanic, its not my claim … cant help if some hollywood articles thinks so! I have maintained TDK will cross 500 from the beginning and it will do so.

Its been someone ele who has been constantly writing essays on how good Titanic is and its trending … when its absurd in the first place to compare a TDK with a Titanic …but then, grey cells are a rarity these days … but abusive fanatical clans are not!
Comment by SHETTY on 2 August 2008:

“For the record Jason and I have never exchanged an email”

You both exchange email or exchange saliva, We are least bothered. But Satyam teaming up with that dick jason lowers your standard..

Well I wanted to keep myself out of this but couldn’t control
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

But I must nonetheless commend Ach for putting up the Watchmen preview. It is indeed extremely clear. Perhaps it should be done in a separate post. Of course those of us who saw TDK in the US saw the preview in the theater. Will be interesting to see what kind of initial the film gets. Because many people are not aware of this series.
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

I think Ach you might want to look up Ku Klux Klan in an encyclopedia or someplace!

Shetty: I think that’s unfair. JasonTodd (beside the fact that he is absolutely the authority on the comic book universe along with Qalandar) has a much more let’s say ‘informal’ style of communicating here. I don’t see him as meaning to offend for the most part.

Ach on the other hand is purposely abusive most of the time. Just check out his comments since yesterday.
Comment by Ravi on 2 August 2008:

I don’t know Shetty and Ach bhailog, I actually like Jason Todd and he is fun to read.

He comes out as a welcome relief.
Comment by Achilles on 2 August 2008:

Unlike some, i am the last who needs ‘encyclopedia or someplace’!
Comment by SHETTY on 2 August 2008:

Point taken Satyam
Comment by Achilles on 2 August 2008:

As for watchmen … dont know how successful the movie will be in box-office … but going by the strong plot of the series, it shud be a good movie.

Wolverine shud better a better opening as its a spinoff of the X series and also a far more popular character among fans.
Comment by satyam on 2 August 2008:

I am not too excited about wolverine. Should be fun though. But yes Watchmen I am really looking forward to.
Comment by rks on 2 August 2008:

I was about to close the thread but there has been some sense of sanity towards end.

Jason: I understand your language is informal (though you must recognize that we all have different planes of comfort in what we speak and hear) and you never get personal but calling Ach was not in good taste. This is because you are not a friend with ACh. If you are a friend then probably you can use something like this to admonish. But since this is a public forum and most us don’t know each other at personal level it should always be avoided.

Ach: I know the exchange between you and Satyam is testy but you could have just emailed me about Jason’s comment instead of calling Jason back with something similar.

Others: If there is some exchange which you don’t like, please email me the thread. There is no point in aligning with members with same wavelength. It makes the atmosphere more bitter.
Comment by JasonTodd on 2 August 2008:

sidenote: i cant believe im going on the fucking defensive
i called ach a dick not because i think he’s a dick but because his constant berating of satyam (who’s views in this thread i very much thought made sense and valid) was dickery. im not apologizing

- if satyam and i excahgned emails that would be like total awesomeness that no one would be able to handle ( i think it would go like this)

satyam - stuff that goes over my head for 5 minutes of reading
jason todd - ummmm i like colours, do you like colours?

yeah itd be THAT awesome

- i dont care about sarkar raj’s BO, i havent seen the film fully yet either, but whatever the case, whatever

- Leo is dreamy

- im my own guru, i tried to drink guru once, it kinda sucks, ah who am i kidding it taste like fuck

- im gonna get killed for this, but return of the jedi is my fave

- the only people that will be happier than me when TDK crosses 500 mil domestically will be Allan Horn and Paul Levitz

- its very valid to compare titanic to TDK - big event movies, large production companies, major property (only BB and batman and robin didnt make an opening record) and major director (james fucking cameron_ this is a very valid apples and apples comparison in type of film, its apples and organged because of the era.

- Watchmen is gonna be the shiznit, im watchign that fucker in IMAX

- i like big butts and i can not lie

- people that dont understand robin just dont understand batman either (and that includes christian bale and chris nolan)

- Wolverines gonna be a clusterfuck

- Jason Todd is gonna take over Nightwing’s book after Dick Grayson takes over the cowl in like January and Damian becomes Robin, that makes me wonder who the fuck’s tim drake gonna be

- ooooooo Neil Gaiman’s writing Whatever Happened to the Caped Crusader, FUCK YEAH!